Hello everybody welcome to The County Seat
I'm your host Chad Booth. Once again it is our
honor and privilege to discuss issues of the
state with the Governor of the State of Utah,
Governor Gary Herbert. He has been a good
friend and supporter of our show and of the
state and of the citizens of Utah Governor it's
good to spend time with you today.
Thank you, it's good to be with you Chad and I
am a big fan of the County Seat as a former
county commissioner I understand some of the
unique challenges our counties face.
Very good I hope the county commissioners are
listening. There have been a lot of things going
on as we were coming up to this conversation
today I was trying to think about what the
number one issue was and I think the biggest
head line issue in the entire year has been
forest fires and it has been an issue you have
been passionate about and outspoken about.
We have had a lot of them and nearly 900
forest fires throughout the state of Utah this
past season over half of them man caused.
There is some foolishness here mistakes made
there and we have a lot forest fires we have
been fortunate in what we have not lost in
structures at Herriman fire we lost a few homes
but the 120,0000 acre fire in Southern Utah
county we really dodged a bullet there and no
structures or lives lost really almost miracle.
That being said we have got to start addressing
very serious way the health of our forests we
are not able to spray for the bark beetle a lot of
dead fall underbrush growth part of the
problem with management fire in southern
Utah county they got a lighting strike and got a
fire going they saw an opportunity to clean up
some of the undergrown and dead fall and a
wind came and next thing you know it's out of
control and we burn 120,000 acres of land and
forest so we can do better and we should do
better and we can do better.
So in doing so what are the challenges in
making forest management work because we
have so many restrictions on forest lands from
the US forest service and even some they
cannot get around they got cornered on the
original bark beetle infestations on Cedar
Mountain and they could not get around it so
what are some of the challenges.
Well clearly we need to get regulations the
common sense that allows those experts that
are tasks with managing the forests to do it with
it optimal benefit to make it healthy and have
healthy forests and trees and protects our
water shed that helps us with our quality issues
our animals out there the flora and fauna all
those coming together to have a healthy vibrant
forests so we are proposing the fact with the
Roadless road well intended as it may have
been we find unintended consequences as a
lack of flexibility and lack of being able to
manage the forests to their optimal benefit we
cannot thin out the tress or not be able to go in
there and scarf out the undergrowth not able to
have any prescribed burns not being able to
take any kind of mechanized equipment in
there so there needs to be flexibility given to
those who are tasks to manage the forest if
they do that its win win win for everybody the
forest for our environment our watersheds it's a
win for us they want to go out and recreate and
the great outdoors for the ranchers and farmers
it is something we need to do and by the way
it's already been done in Colorado and Idaho
working with the Department of Interior Forests
and Department of Agriculture see if we can
find better ways to manage the forests and
modify the Roadless rule.
Do you think it's ironic in a way that the five
things you said that you compromised by the
fires are the inability to handle the Roadless
rule are the very five qualities that the Roadless
rule said it was trying to protect.
I don't think any of us should be surprised that
good intentions sometimes go awry the
intentions are good but sometimes the
unintended consequences are something
unexpected. We had a chance to try it and see
where we need to write some modifications
and improvements and give the flexibility of
those who are tasked with managing the
experts you don't want to tie a farmers hand
going out there who is trying to grow his crops
well you can't irrigate here and fertilize there
cannot pull the weeds here you can get as good
as a yield if they let those kind of restrictions
on a farmer same things true with us we have
to be in charges and do a better job and good
stewards of the earth and I think we try to do
that we see a need for improvement here.
Excellent one of the other things has been a
consistent headline since we talked is the
Opioid dilemma it is surfaces it has started a lot
of lawsuits counties gotten involved legally in in
what is your take and where you think Utah
should chart its course and where we stand.
Well it is a crisis certainly of epidemic
proportion with opioid addiction and death
overdose we brought it to the forefront with
the national governors association when I was
the chairman we saw what happened
throughout the country. Since 2011 we have
seen a systematic increase in the abuse and use
of opioids we have tried to make people more
aware of the challenges not only the public but
doctors it appears that those who produce the
opioids have withheld the information about its
addictive qualities we have tried to emphasize
the doctors opioids as a pain killer ought to be a
last resort not a first resort thing we have
worked with our pharmacists to label our
prescription bottles this is addictive and
hazardous to your health there is a warning
label on it we have opportunity with the Utah
medical association awareness campaigns for
doctors and patients and the good news for us
is although there has been an increase since
2011 in Utah this last year we have seen a
significant decrease with heroin use we have a
decrease of about 14% in heroin deaths that is a
major stride other parts its going up ours is
going down we have found with opioid
addiction we have had reductions of 16%
getting better awareness and education and
training and being available to reverse the
effects of overdose I feel good about the trend
not where we want to be but we are on the
right road going in the right direction.
One of the big components of that when people
find themselves at the end of reap they end up
in a drug court and getting right treatment
mental health that is tied to Medicaid become
yet another issue.
It certainly is amazing how wavering is related
certainly we need to put more money as a state
and with our judiciary drug courts and mental
health courts. Rather than just warehouse
these people if they have a problem we will see
if we can get them off the addiction make them
to become productive members of society.
Same as mental health problem let's get them
treatment and medication to help them with
their issues and make them productive
members of societies. We have the people that
are working well and so again our Medicaid
expansion its significant issue and the healthy
Utah approach which allowed us to draw back
monies that we are sending to Washington DC
and utilized and expanded health care program
it has served us well it had the a cap on how
much could be spent but it did not happen we
are working with the new waiver approach with
the Fed government most will be approved but
they want the the legislation to pass it first do
that next session we issues out there with
significant tax increase and no capping of the
costs and can be a significant bite of budge
already about 19% of budget to Medicaid now
with Medicaid expansion it could go to 28% and
maybe into the 35% over the next 5 to 6 years
that is significant budget hole buster and that is
going to be a real concern for us in the fiscal
aspect of our budgets.
If you were to make an encouragement to
people would you think that the initiative is not
the right way to deal with this issue because a
lot of people haven't voted yet.
Well, I'm not going to vote for because I think it's
fiscally irresponsible. I think there's better ways
to do it like the healthy Utah approach the
waiver approach we've got on the table right
now is a better approach it will in fact expand
healthcare access to many many people
100,000 or so of those who are on the low end
of the economic scale. So that's what we're
trying to do is to make sure that those who need
it the most will have access to healthcare and so
without breaking the budget and I think there is a
better option. That being said, I understand
frustration with people because we haven't got
anything done other than the very minimal
approach and were actually paying significant
taxes revenue to do it. I just think we need to
come together if I was king for a day and I'm not
but if I was king for a day what Washington
should do is to block Grant the monies to each
respective state that way they can have
whatever kind of program that works best for
their unique demographic and unique politics.
Everybody's treated the same it will give for the
first time a number that Congress can budget to
would be nice if they actually budgeted to a
number and actually put out a balanced budget
something. Similar to a balanced budget. It gives
the states a number two balance. If you block
grant it no state would be advantaged, and no
state would be disadvantaged but you would
have the flexibility to come to your own
healthcare Medicaid expansion program that will
fit your unique circumstances. That's probably
the best solution that is out there for the
Medicaid issue. I would hope that Congress
could see the wisdom of that and this
administration, Trump, Pence would push for
something like a block grant approach.
Excellent, this is a good place to take a break
and I know you've got to make a phone call and
we've got a couple of commercials to run so will
be right back with the County seat in just a
minute.
Welcome back to The County Seat talking with
Gov. Gary Herbert on a whole list of issues. One
of the ones that have been very concerning to
and has been for years to particularly the rural
counties is the situation in jail funding. It seems
that they are caught in a trap every year of
having to come up with their hand out asking the
legislature to try and fund the cost of prisoners
that they keep on behalf of the state in the jails.
Is there any end to this problem?
it's hat in hand, asking please, kind sir.
oh yeah.
it's like Groundhog Day when I was a County
Commissioner back in the early 90s. We came
up here and argued on behalf of jail
reimbursement and later in jail contracting they
have kind of been combined. But there are two
different issues. I've as the governor have
always put in the full amount in the budget.
Sometimes the legislature does not fund it all.
They appropriate but don't fund and the
authorization is there. We're funding probably
right now about 83% of the rate that we give on
jail contracting and on jail reimbursement it's
probably around $14 million. If my memory
serves me correctly, I expect it will be more next
year. The need for us to as the state have
collaboration, cooperation with the counties we
contract when we need to have more bed space
and that's worked out pretty well most of the
time there's been some glitches along that line
some of our counties but also jail reimbursement
which is where the court imposes the state
prisoner into a County jail and that should be in
fact the cost of that should be I think defrayed by
the state that's been an ongoing battle. That
being the case we're doing more now than ever
before. So, the trend is good whether we can
ever get to 100%. I guess remains to be seen,
but I think you'll see us put in the budget again
coming up, we're cognizant of the issue. We
support the counties in this to be 100%
reimbursed and will try to do what we can to
make that happen with the legislature.
is there a way that the legislature. I mean, it's
going to be up to them they have to create a
legislation to do it.
they spend every dollar. I recommend but they
make the final decision and you know some of it
is lack of awareness somebody's going to
champion the cause Association of counties and
the commissioners need to be up here along
with Sheriff's saying you know it's not fair for you
to balance your state budget on the backs of the
County budget and somewhat that happens with
jail reimbursement but they have no choice on
that one jail contracting is a negotiated thing. So,
it's probably not as big of an issue. But again,
the squeaky wheel gets the grease. I know you
like to have ongoing funding, so you don't have
to, hat in hand every year we have ongoing
funding and one-time money combined to make
the 14 million I would love to have it all ongoing
money, so you don't have to worry about it in the
next appropriation.
excellent, well, that's a very good answer. Let's
shift our topics to rural. You set out a rural jobs
initiative last year and it made a big rollout of
and you were going to get 25,000 jobs in 25
counties. How are we doing?
well, we're actually ahead of the pace we
wanted to have 25,000 jobs by the end of 2020.
We have just under 9000 now since we started
so were slightly ahead of the pace it's an
ongoing challenge. And it's not just you need to
Utah. It's unique to the entire rural setting here
throughout America more and more of the
economic growth and development is taking
place in urbanized areas probably for a variety
of reasons. What we've done is we've met
virtually every County of the 25 off the Wasatch
front and said this can't be top-down we're going
to tell you what to do from Salt Lake City and the
capital you've got to decide what are your
strengths. What are your weaknesses and what
is your pathway forward. This needs to be
bottom up and let the state be your partner. Let
us help you in whatever quest you have and it's
unique. You know the one size doesn't fit all,
and we've had good conversations with the
economic development directors. We certainly
have a world trade center tour that we have the
Lt. Gov. go around to the different counties and
kind of do an assessment our go Ed office
economic development. Some of our grant
programs to help stimulate and be a catalyst or
economic development and growth, but it's got
to come bottom-up there is disruption in the
marketplace. We have it all the time were going
to need to protect the family farmer and the
family ranch I understand the passion but with
increasing yields our family farm in Idaho, which
we still have them play a lot more people than it
employees today even though we have more
acreage more spuds were planting up there in
Idaho but were employing fewer people that's kind
of the dynamic in the change that happen in the
marketplace. When it comes to farming and
ranching. So, we've got to reinvent ourselves,
what we have our strengths what can we
propose how do we develop more entrepreneurs
and see if we can grow business in side our
counties in the rural part of the state or how are
we doing on education. Clearly the skeletal
alignment in what is now a global marketplace.
We need to make sure that our graduates from
high school and on to college are as high in the
rural areas as they are in the urbanized area or
else our kids are going to be shortchanged on
their ability to find a new job get a good
education get a good job. It's that simple. So,
we're attacking this on many fronts. We certainly
want to be partners. We want to in fact have the
local governments the local counties to tell us
what do we need and how can we help you, but
you develop your own plan.
excellent, were going to take a quick break. We'll
come up with some final thoughts with the
governor. We will put our focus on all of these
ballot initiatives. When we come back, we'll be
right back.
Welcome back to the County seat, talking to
Gov. Gary Herbert from the Gold room at the
state Capitol as you see it's not the normal
County seat digs. Governor, we have four ballot
initiatives. One question and three initiatives on
the ballot we've touched on one of them, but
let's talk about the others we've got a gas tax,
which is kind of an educational tax which is good
particularly the rural counties in a conundrum
because they need attention to both roads and
in education. We've got the medical marijuana
and
Let's take them one at a time.
Okay, let's do it.
Gasoline tax increase $.10 it might be
interesting for everybody to know that according
to the Utah foundation the amount of money that
we spend the percentage of our income to the
gasoline tax is the lowest it's ever been since the
inception of the gasoline tax in 1929. So, our
proportion of our money we are spending into
gasoline is the lowest it's ever been on the tax,
so we haven't really kept up with inflation and
purchasing power of the tax so it's probably
smart to do anyways. In good policy. If you want
to build roads what we've been doing, though is
robbing the general fund monies to pay for
roads. It should be going to education. I'm so
what will happen is both issues will be
addressed with this gasoline tax. 75% will be
going to the classroom and schools helping us
with education teacher salaries those kind of
things will help improve our educational
achievement for our students and 25% will go
into roads and road maintenance which were
deficient on so it's win-win. It's something we
ought to do so. I hope people will vote for
question number one.
Okay, very good. Let's talk about medical
marijuana.
Medical marijuana again I think most everybody
is supportive of any kind of medicine or product
which will help alleviate pain and suffering and
hence medical cannabis has come to the
forefront in saying that this is maybe an option
the disappointment for many of us is then why is
not the federal government doing the testing.
The clinical trials, etc. to get FDA approval
rather than just saying, well, forget the law on
the books that prohibits it, and will just turn a
blind eye as states more and more are starting
to say well we want to have medical use of
marijuana or cannabis to help alleviate pain and
suffering in Utah. We've tried to do the right
things in the right way the public is been
understandably frustrated just get something
done. We think there are stories out here that
will give us hope and so we have come to I think
a point where no matter what happens with the
initiative whether it passes or fails we will get
back together in a special session and
implement a compromise that the proponents
and the opponents have come together so we
will make sure that accessibility in an
appropriate way to those that can use medical
cannabis for pain and suffering and yet we won't
open the doors towards recreational use of
marijuana and protect the health and safety of
the public at large, and particularly our young
people.
Excellent, governor it's always a pleasure to sit
and talk with you and I'll take you up on your
offer to maybe bring some commissioners and
come back.
Come back, we'll have you at the Gold room as
many times as you want come let's have some
additional discussion. I'm a big believer in the
counties there doing great work out there our
County elected officials, so best wishes to them
and we want to be to partner
excellent, well remember local government is
where your life happens be involved. Be part of
the solution and we will see you next week on
the County seat
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