This is Deliverance Ministry.FM Videocast, episode 19,
Welcome to another episode of Deliverance Ministry.FM, where we give you proven insights,
both the demonic realm and deliverance ministry so you can wage spiritual warfare more effectively.
My name is Dr Don Ibbitson and I'm here with my colleague Dr Phyllis Tarbox.
Got An interesting topic today.
Phyllis, people or clients if you like, that the Lord has been bringing us and it really
has to do in the realm of dealing with children and self injuring or cutting.
We've seen a lot of that over the past little while, right?
Yeah.
Well, you know, I knew it was on God's heart because they're one week I think I had for
telephone calls from moms, um, actually had several telephone calls from moms in one week
and poor children actually came in that were self injuring.
So once that happened, it put me into a bootcamp very quickly with the Lord because I needed
to know how to help these young young ones.
Right?
Well, that's a sign that it's the Lord.
That's how we got started really in deliverance ministry because all records were very short
seasons, like weeks.
We went a long time with no kids, it seemed like earlier days, but all of a sudden bang
like one after the other or started bringing his children who needed deliverance in this.
I really need to develop something here in the realm of children's deliverance.
The same sort of thing that helped me with is this realm of cutting rates in short order.
People started coming through the door and did a lot of research on that.
Right?
I did.
I read like a lot, really fast and I had to understand from their perspective what was
going on and the good thing about it was, you know, a lot of times when, and we're talking
like 10, 12 and 13.
Sadly when that group comes in, that group before they hit the 14 and 15 year old mark
for me are quite chatty and usually still pretty affectionate.
Then they, they wanted help, so I was really blessed with the ones that came in.
I think about them very affectionately even now because they helped me
help them.
Well, we're going to try and pass some of that information onto you as parents maybe
listening to this because it is a topic.
It is a phenomenon, I guess you'd have to call it that that's really growing.
In fact, there's some statistics that says that the children who were doing this, they
call it an epidemic that is doubled literally, probably over the last few years, three years
or children that are really doing this.
And um, why do you think, I mean, from your perspective, where do you, what do you think's
been happening that why this is more prevalent in this age group?
Well, I think the young, it's getting younger because they don't have the ability to really
understand or articulate their pain.
So they, they don't, they can't go get on antidepressants.
They, they, they, they don't know how to express to their parents what's wrong?
Why, why are they feeling so sad?
And there's a non communication of something new for them, this sadness or this pain that
they feel in their heart.
So they take matters into their own hands.
And sadly that's an influence.
It's coming from other children and their age group that now they're, they're talking
about it with their, their, their peers.
Well, I know somebody who's had that problem and you know, they've used blades to kill
their emotional plane and, and, and so I've watched the age of this because even though
we didn't start working with the children on this right from the get go, I've had like
the 18 to 20 year old group that was coming in.
I think one of the first ones, she was a college, I think she was a college senior.
No, she's college freshmen that came in and she had been cutting.
But since then I've watched this go down now, like I said, all the way down to 10 years
old.
Yeah.
You see basically it's a non talk talking.
We're not communication form of trying to deal with their own pain.
Seems to be.
Yeah.
And that age group, you know, with that age group at that pre adolescent, that adolescent
age group, they, they're going from, you know, being mommy's little girl or mommy's little
boy to an area of now where they're starting to get independents.
And there, there's a lot going on in them and they don't know how to articulate it,
they don't know how to speak it out.
And so this is an answer, sadly, that's been introduced and I believe it's been introduced
by the demonic realm.
I'm just probably going to talk about this summer.
There's a lot of resources if you like, you can call them out on the Internet.
It's not just kids talking to each other in school on their own.
I mean there's places they can go to.
Our gender generation now has access to technology, you know, four or five year old granddaughter
and she couldn't, she couldn't make that ipad just sitting the bark, you know?
And so the kids are skilled at finding things.
So there's a lot more of that information.
We haven't even seen the full internet generation come to maturity.
And I mean and, and so these numbers are gonna Really.
I'm not going to speak negatively, but it can become a phenomena that's going to be
pretty big.
So let's, let's delve into the topic in some more depth.
You're hopefully it gets toward the end.
We're going to give some directions and hopefully help for you as parents that maybe especially
if you think you're a suspect, even though some of this might be happening to your child,
but let's begin by saying what kind of.
What is the nature of some of the aspects of cutting herself that we know are typically
kids are doing
OK, so here's the recent data on self injury and what it.
What it actually looks like is it's not, you know, it's not just cutting back cutting is
a part of it where they take a blade and exacto knife or maybe a razor blade or something
sharp that they've found and they begin injuring themselves by making small cuts.
Also burning is a part of it or interfering with that wound healing by picking a reopening
the wounds.
I've noticed that with a lot of them or they'll come in and they'll just start picking, picking,
picking at their, their old wound because it hurts them and because they become fascinated
with the blood punching or hitting themselves or other objects.
I've seen that, or you know, inserting objects into or under the skin, purposely bruising
or breaking their bones and certain forms of hair, pulling, pulling their hair out,
anything that causes pain that, that, that takes the pain off of their emotions because
if they can deflect the pain onto physical pain,
we got emotional pain,
right?
And so what happens is the enemy convinces them that, ah, this is helping.
It's easing, it's easing and softening their pain because they do get a temporary, um,
basically a temporary high from the, the, the endorphins or whatever that is released
when they're cutting, and then their emotional pain calms down for a short period of time,
but what they, what they're not recognizing is this is actually amplifying the enemy's
hold on them and they get fewer and fewer breaks of the pain release.
And so now they've got this physical go to place where they are and the emotional is
coming back faster.
So they're not.
They're not recognizing this isn't helping long-term.
It's actually wrapping them in deeper
maybe for benefit of this podcast or center and deliverance ministry to understand why
you wouldn't use the word enemy, the demonic realm, but we see this as a spiritual practice,
so the enemy is not a person is not the mom and the dad or the demonic realm, the core,
you know, what's going on here is there are as demonic, the demonic realm and how they
operate and so it's a spiritual struggle that's not a classic psychological, mental, emotional,
you know, the world would have one way of looking at this and we tend to see this given
that we're, you know, we're in a spiritual battle.
Struggle is not against flesh and blood, but it's a spiritual issue.
So the enemy you're referring to are demons.
Demonic realm.
Yes.
Yes.
It does start out as an emotional cry for help.
I think that's the thing that we need to understand this is this, when your children are doing
this, this is not.
I would say in a few percentage of the cases, it could be a suicide attempt, but the, I
would say the majority is not.
It is not focused on suicide to begin with.
It's really an emotional pain that they're trying to get.
They're trying to get some satisfaction or some healing to on their own and they don't
know how else to do it.
Once again, our view is that the door opened, the door opened doors for demonic demons can't
jump on entry points.
What have you seen typically as the, as the open doors, if you'd like, for this type of
demonic torment in these children's
biggest one at that age group is feeling like they don't fit in.
Like they don't have friends share rejected.
They've got low self esteem, you know, the enemies, you know, he's always trying to get,
get the, the kid, the child away from the pack and making them feel like they're abandoned
or isolated or rejected or they don't have any friends or they're not cute enough.
Pretty enough.
They don't fit in well enough.
Uh, 50 percent, uh, stat shows that 50 percent of children who self injure have been either
physically or sexually abused.
Wow.
But also children who are really high achievers and perfectionists, that's a way for them
to cope with emotional pain of maybe not being as perfect as they think they should be.
So now you've got, you know, all the temperament types moved into this.
You've got the ones that are, have the low self esteem, you've got the ones who have
the high achieving perfectionist kind of an attitude.
So you've got the more laid back, you've got the type A and then you've got the ones that
had been physically and sexually abused most of the time they're females.
So that's what was going to ask you.
Seen or what percentage are young girls
always seen girls?
I mean, I haven't seen any boys come in here.
I think the, I think the stats on it are overwhelmingly girls.
I would say probably like nine.
I think they're 90 percent and 10 percent because they, you know, as women we're wired
different than men, right?
So yeah, we have a tendency to internalize anger more frequently than men do.
Men would externalize it or even communicated in a different way.
Probably go out and, you know, do something like play basketball or football or you know,
beat themselves up with each other, I don't know, but girls don't do that and we're wired
different and so they look for private places to explain, you know, handle their pain.
So this is a pretty alarming.
Generally rejection.
Yeah.
Low self esteem.
It could be rejection.
Even in the bloodline.
It could be a generational curse with injection point treated maybe single word or single
mothers or you know, or not want.
It even could be something as simple as this surprise child, right?
Or not.
Not or distracted
in, in the week that I had all these young ones come in the whole gamut.
I had one that had, was sexually abused, one that was a perfectionist and one that had
low self esteem and didn't fit in.
So God gave me the full picture all at once.
So there was no.
Two of them were like that, that, that whole time, that whole summer we work together.
So what sort of thing or parents who are listening to this and your father or even just relative,
what's, what are warning signs, what indicators that the appearance is a potential issue in
their childhood?
Everybody will tell you any kind of changes in behavior including any time that they're
spending more time alone, you know, so for things that are isolating
them, spending more time in their room, withdrawing from the family, um, number two would be,
you know, long showers or spending large amount of time in the bathroom because you don't
know what they're doing in there and you know, just that's not the place where you're going
to walk in on them.
And they know that teens when they start doing their laundry, I mean, I don't know, teens
usually let you do that, right?
So if they start washing their own seats and start doing their own clothes when they previously
hadn't done that, then you maybe suspect that there could be blood on the sheet close.
Yeah.
Suddenly using large amounts of toilet paper or facial tissue.
If you start rolling through it faster than you were before, it could be because.
Because again, at the blood or when they start wearing long sleeves, like in summer or wearing
a lot of bracelets around their risks to cover up where they've started to cut, if you see
new cuts or injuries that appear without a logical explanation or there frequently accessing
online self injury groups or websites, you can research that and look and see where they're
frequented spots are.
Uh, if they start talking, you know, here's, here's this another.
They start talking about their friends at school that our cutters and, you know, what
would you know, would they want to talk to you about that other girl?
Then, you know, listen, because generally if they're, if they're hanging around with
somebody that's using that, they're entertaining that as a thought, as a possibility themselves.
So keep your ears open to that sort of thing.
So you have parents, I guess usually more times I'm sure the mother many times or maybe
making a call to come in here and you meet with the parents, right?
You meet with the mother first.
He made me meet with the child or both together.
What would I like to do is I like to either have a phone call time with the mom so I can
hear the mom's side of the story and what she's found out and then bring the child in,
um, or we can, if the child is old enough, the child can sit out in the other room and
I'll have a little bit of time with the mom, a little time with both of them and then a
little bit of time with just the child so that their heart can be heard.
And will we kind of wrap that in more as we go alone.
Time with each of these children don't necessarily want to talk in front of their parents, but
with the younger ones, they still want to talk.
See, that's the whole thing.
They really want to unburden their heart.
They want a place to really share so they don't want to do it in front of their mother
all the time.
But so what I found is just breaking the whole session up into bits and pieces, you know,
little alone with one on one and allowing them some time.
Um, the, the child's, you know, that's, I think that's the best way to do it.
There's, like I said, that summer where I had all three different.
Why use different protocol for each one, but a general format of what we're doing is not
a recipe.
Yes, exactly.
Exactly.
Exactly.
So takes, you know, of course the child admitting it and repenting of it,
they, they want to have.
The child wants to be held, right.
How are you going to help anybody who, who doesn't want problem?
Has that been your experience with the time these girls come in and generally they say,
hey, this is a problem.
Again, not to say that, that I haven't had luck with the older ones, the older ones that
are in their twenties, they, they know better than they've been probably stuck with some
of this behavior intermittently throughout their teens and they want to be free for younger
ones.
The 10, 11, 12, 13 heading into it, we need to catch it at the bud sometimes when you
get into the 15 and 16 year old group, they're not quite as open and they get a little more
rebellious about you taking away their form of emotional release.
So that's where I think it gets a little bit trickier.
But yes, generally you want to have their repentance, you want to have their buy in
and you want them to be willing.
That's what it takes for them.
We can say that's a truism of all kinds of thing.
It's hard, hard to help anybody who doesn't want to be helped.
And so we like to want to see that.
So that's what you're looking for in the child, but I mean what kind of encouragement or things
directors do you have for the, and I know you've been through a process, so there's
multiple be able to get into all of that today, but what is your general direction or things
you try to encourage the parents with?
Well, I think the parents need to remain calm.
OK.
And you know, stay in a calm and caring, loving relationship with your child and accept them
even if you disagree with the behavior that they're exhibiting.
OK?
And know that this really represents a way of them dealing with their emotional pain.
Listen, gotTa, listen to them.
Start Spinning.
Yeah.
Maybe you're not all the parents to write.
Do you see sometimes where the parents have had, they've had good upbringings and or the
kids are getting this somewhere else?
Does that sometimes happen?
Oh yeah.
Peer pressure is after fresh.
And a lot of times the little girls, you know, it could be anything.
It could be like the little boy didn't look at them that day the way they want.
I mean it can, it can be anything.
But it's a cry for help.
It is bottom line, it's a cry for help.
So listening with compassion to them is really key.
And don't get panicky or get or overreact.
It's not something that you want to shove underneath the rug at all.
You don't want to just ignore it.
But I don't want, you don't want the parents to just, you know, cause I get the phone calls
were there almost hysterical because this is a hard thing.
It comes out of nowhere, but don't panic, don't overreact and don't show shock or revulsion
at what they've done because, you know, it's really hard for the parents when they see
like this one, one little girl had been doing it for a long, long time before the parents
had found out and when she lifted her pant leg to show them, I mean, you know, that's,
that's rough on a parent, but you got to really try not to be repulsed or so soc.
OK?
Don't use any time, any type of threats in attempt to stop their behavior.
In other words, you don't, don't threaten them that you're going to take this away and
you're taking that away.
We a bribe.
I'm right, it's, this is deeper than that.
So that's not gonna work.
Um, don't allow them to start talking about their self injury experience in detail because
once they start meditating on what they've done and why it fires up, all of those neurons
in their brain and it actually triggers, um, well another response, it could be a good
stir up sadness and all over again, and then they'll have another session of cutting and
get help.
OK, get qualified mental health.
Get somebody that can be helping them either with, in deliverance, in counseling, and a
safe place for them to share.
I've had some experiences.
We have an approach where you really developed an approach to try to help these young girls.
I mean maybe you could just kind of give a brief overview of the process we use and then
some of the cases on the case histories that you've had with somebody.
Girls.
Well, you know, again, it's, it's kind of fluid and moving, but just bringing them in
and getting into, into a place of understanding their heart is the first part.
I want to hear what the parents have to say.
I want to hear what the children have to say once I get a comfort level of a relationship
with that child and we started understanding some of the things that have triggered at
some of the things that have brought it up, then we can kind of tailor a prayer.
I'm careful with this, so I have always just let the holy spirit walk those.
It's not like I can say this is our six or five step approach.
I have a process.
We've developed a lot of forums where there's actually a contract between the parents and
the doctors got some homework.
We've got some, some, some ideas of creating safe places and, and you know, and it eventually
leads to praying.
Sometimes it's just breaking generational curses, you know, one little girl, you know,
I just loved it.
As I prayed, I prayed very gently for her.
It was, and when I say this, it's like maybe 15, 20 minutes.
I prayed for her, but her tears of repentance when they landed on my lap when I was praying
for her, I think was one of the most moving things ever because this little girl was.
She was really artistic, she really wrote our own songs and wrote her own music and
she was, she was desirous to get help.
But um, you know, she had gotten involved actually in a, an online web group, which
I don't know if some of the parents have actually heard about this, but it's this, this grouping
is something called Jeff the killer and it was a young, like a cartoon figure that somehow
or another wraps this young age group in with these stories about how this, these killings
and things and they, it's an for him to be their boyfriend, you know, a little 13.
You're talking 12, maybe 11 year old mind that comes across this and there's an online
group and they have access to cutting with this sort of thing.
You know.
Cause when you look at him as Jeff, the killer he is, he's completely slashed.
So it makes it like cool to be his girlfriend and he gets a little hot.
You just hear that spiritual darkness did this thing.
I mean it's just.
Yeah, because once she went and crossed that borderline with just a, this youth, this grouping
of Jeff, the killer, it left her website.
She actually, yeah, she actually, um, then went out and started having online conversations
with who she thought was a 16 year old boy and my guess would be he was not, so it Kinda
got her out into the outside world just by the clicks on that website, so not good.
And then of course, you know, the sadness and the darkness and the loneliness started
overtake her and her cutting was her way of escaping or pain.
So that was, that was not good.
And then of course, like I said, the other ones were either sexually abused and so a
lot of that they had to come in and they had to get down to understanding the soul ties
that were involved.
Certainly the soul ties with the friends and that sort of thing.
So
she was cutting too
in painting from the sexual abuse abuse.
So it is, uh, like I said, we walked it out step by step, did incorporate some deliverance
of, um, a lot of prayer, a lot of level of homework.
It's just a different kind of flow with this, with this group.
Well, I think it's important to emphasize is you say see the cutting.
It's not generally as suicide.
No, it's not.
It's more of that cry for help with emotional pain and transferring it over into the, um,
into the physical realm.
Now, if this continues for a long period of time, you know that the enemy's agenda is
to take it into a suicidal position when the pain gets too hard because the only progressive
older group of kids will say they've heard the enemy.
Tell them to just do it.
Just do it.
Just kill yourself.
You've already got the blade, the door is locked, just do it.
So it goes that way because the enemy comes to kill, steal it.
And once again, we repeated often, but it bears repeating.
This is, these are spiritual things, these voices, this is the demonic realm.
Speaking.
These things, these demonic spirits, they speak to people, they don't tell them to read
the Bible and go to church and help the poor.
This is easy.
It's, it's, it's about destruction or they're hurting themselves or hurting somebody else
or both.
And so that that's the theme of it and that's what happened is these open doors for this
demonic spirits, they enter in the about generational curses, word curses, ungodly bondings with
people talking to other things about abuse and trauma in a person's life.
And certainly sexual abuse is that.
That's an open door, so any number of things.
So I think it bears repeating.
There's just not one quick fix.
There's not one thing to pray or do that,
but the parents can certainly lead their children first, often to repent and forgiveness, you
know, even there when you get disclosure, just leave the child in an act of repentance
for the self mutilation and have them forgive themselves.
Certainly most of this will be handled in the office, but it's going to begin with them
with the understanding that they're loved, they're forgiven and they need to forgive
themselves.
OK, and then, you know, as a parent you can break the ungodly soul tie because what I've
seen in counseling, there's usually a friend that suggests the idea, so there's a clear
soul tie.
Would that person where they, where they've introduced the idea and that needs to either
be broken, they can do it or you can do it together.
Hopefully we tell parents to break off relationships.
Yeah,
yeah.
That needs to be a disconnection of communication with the contact as well.
Yeah.
So you know, and that, that means like removing their name from their cell phone or facebook
on friending them on instagram and et cetera.
Um, typically because once you break the soul tie, the enemy is always going to try to reestablish
it with some kind of quick contact.
So ask, ask them if they have any.
This is key.
Ask them if they have any shared articles.
Would that person like blades, you know, there's this airblades yeah.
Clothes, jewelry.
Um, you don't want them to remain in their possession, so have them get rid of all of
that.
All the cutting tools.
Lots of times what I'll do is when they come in, I have them throw the cutting tools out
in front of me prophetically.
It's good to have them do that, so or have them do it
part of it and just have the parents throw them most part of that process.
Getting rid of it.
Yeah, and then break any word curses, um, that they have spoken over themselves or that
others have spoken over them along with anything that could be tight, texted, written, journaled,
any packs or vows that they've made of secrecy with each other's.
Sometimes a physical bullying or cyber bullying is present.
So be sure to break all are written, spoken words that have been, that been made them
feel bad about themselves that have caused a lot of this emotional pain.
Like you're stupid or you're dumb, or you're ugly, or no boy would ever want you, or you're
a loser or this is the only way.
A lot of times they, you know, they commiserate with each other.
This is the only way I can get rid of my pain.
This is my, this is my pain medication.
You want to break all of that?
I have a whole list of them.
The armature got more respected.
I don't know if there's more bullying going on and days and years past or if we just hear
about it more sensitive.
I think with this, with the, with the Internet and have being able to come home from school
with them.
There's a whole lot more time.
That's all face to face at school days before you got home from school was done.
That was done till the next day, but now of course when seen instances, you really can't
get away from facebook.
They get out there so it's so the level.
I could certainly see that boy that would be on the increase and then of course get
them to a Christian counselor that's trained in deliverance and can integrate that process
of deliverance with counseling the children.
We've just seen it work well.
We've covered a lot of ground here quickly and a more certainly much more we can say,
but hopefully it's been helpful if we give parents some thinking and some.
Maybe your ears perked up and your spiritual antenna, this journey.
This is a problem in your child's life and giving you some insights on how to proceed
so we appreciate you listening to this and once again, hope that the Lord has spoken
to you through it and as always, if we can be of help or anything and then that, well,
if you can't find help locally, please, please get with us.
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They're on our website as well.
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Keep the comments coming in, suggestions for future topics.
We, we weren't going to keep doing these consistently in the wanting to be a maximum penalty.
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